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Size, Gender
A new cartoon premiering on The Hub on June 1, 2013. A boy becomes a superhero when he inherits a ring from his deceased aunt. The catch is the ring was meant for a female so he becomes a female superhero named SheZow. SheZow has super-strength and super-speed; a "sonic scream," and SheZow's han ...more
From: guest (Masashi) , 133 months, post #1
I see that the "SheZow" entry has been "slated for deletion" by cj.

I offer a few points that it be retained as falling into that "borderline" grey area mentioned in the Guidelines.

1) Although it's 99% probably just a crossdress, the show remains open to the idea that there is a gender TF, since the issue will never be clearly spelled out in a children's cartoon.

2) Taken as a crossdress disguise, it is of the sort that does morph Guy physically to make the disguise more convincing. Specifically, I am referring to Guy's hair. His hair definitely becomes longer and must be maintained in a particular hairdo in order for SheZow to have the superpowers.

3) Guy's body seems to morph in some other ways when SheZow: his voice can deliver a peircing "Sonic Scream," his hand can enlarge for a "Heavy Handed Super She-Slap." The cartoon posits these as gender-based. Maybe "Size TF" or "superhuman powers" would justify the cartoon's inclusion on the list?

4) Is the mole on SheZow's right cheek just makeup, or a physical TF to make the disguise more convincing? (Okay, it's probably makeup.)

Guy's outward appearance as SheZow is convincing enough that Tara thinks he is her former crimefighting partner (Guy's late Aunt Agnes).

From: kreplach , 133 months, post #2
I more or less agree with what Masashi says, particularly #3 if Superpowers is added as a category on the entry. #4 is pushing it. Full disclosure: I haven't seen the show beyond the intro that's on the web.

From: guest (DC) , 133 months, post #3
In multiple interviews, the creator has made it clear that it is just a costume.
No gender change.

From: sexualitylab , 133 months, post #4
I agree with some of Masashi's points (but I don't agree that it's "just a crossdress"), and I'm also going to repost my two cents on SheZow as an entry here because I think the show's great, and it would be a shame if it were removed:

I would argue for the inclusion of the entry, as there is a transformation of sorts even if it is not physical. He is in essence transforming into the identity of another person, and moreover, this person is female and a superheroine. Other people see him as a different person. In the guidelines, it clearly states that entries "can also include things which are not true transformations but in some way appear to be one." I think the entry should stay, given that SheZow involves a boy becoming a female superheroine and taking on that persona (even if not physically becoming a woman), and given that the show seems popular among TG fans, many who use this site.

From: guest , 133 months, post #5
You keep this and you'll soon be flooded with transvestite entry's, having set a precedent.

From: cj , 133 months, post #6
Firstly, has everyone checked-out the previous SheZow discussion ( )?

Secondly, while sexualitylab has a point, we don't include an entry for Superman for his appearing to transform from mild-mannered Clark Kent into Superman, as it is only a disguise (how nobody in Metropolis can tell, we'll never understand) - as it's clearly a disguise. Strangely we don't have an entry for the Fantastic Four regarding the actual transformations.of Ben and Johnny.

Thirdly...If we skip the whole female aspect of SheZow and focus on the superhero part... does the boy have the superpowers all the time, or just when needed? If the kid does NOT have powers when he's just a kid, it can be argued that when danger is present, he turns into a superhero(ine), otherwise is just a normal kid. But, if like most other power-infused superheroes he has the powers all the time and simply chooses to hide them, then it's just a disguise. So, this may still qualify for inclusion in the database under the super-powers alone, as the gender thing is only a disguise.

No matter how you see, it is certainly something for inclusion here on the message board.

From: sexualitylab , 133 months, post #7
Thanks, cj, for linking the previous thread and for your thoughtful response.

I agree that Superman is basically a disguise, but I also think it would hit a bit of a gray area as well; however, if not many people want it added as an entry, I don't see the point of making a case for it

The boy DOESN'T have ALL his superpowers all the time. He maintains a few like "She-Sense" out of superheroine mode that help him quickly change into SheZow when there's danger, but because he needs the SheZow hair to have powers, he only has most of them when he's SheZow. In other words, he's normal except for a few abilities that are there to help him change quickly, but he only has all the powers when he's changed into SheZow. I also think the change is far more dramatic (he's taking on a completely new superhero identity, one that he neither created himself nor is his same gender) to merit inclusion over say other superhero "transformations." I see where it might fall into a bit of a gray area, but I think it has a case, and like I said, it's popular enough around here that I think it can only help to be included.

To post #5's point, I really don't think so. The show is definitely unique, and I don't think other instances of crossdressing are even close to the same.

From: guest (Jc) , 133 months, post #8
Just make a section for cross-dressing entries. Problem solved

From: guest (AnAlias) , 133 months, post #9
JC, this isn't a TG cataloging site. It's a site for cataloging transformations. Crossdressing is not a transformation.

From: cj , 133 months, post #10
I've edited this entry once again. This time as it appears that the boy does "transform" into a superhero(ine). I think this is one of those grey-areas, so we'll leave it open to discussion.

It has been clearly stated that the main character does not change genders (only costumed as opposite gender), so no gender TF will be included in the entry (that's what the message boards are for). However a TF from normal boy into a boy with super-powers... well, that seems like a TF to me.

From: Alias , 133 months, post #11
Well I could argue that mind swaps and possessions aren't really transformations either, but considering the method by which the character changes identities, this is at least as much of a transformation, as say, Captain Marvel.

As far as category, if not gender, maybe mythical?

From: Holly Dunn , 133 months, post #12
This entry and show intrigues me with regards to inclusion on the board. The costume is very convincing and certainly could be construed a gender change. Though Quantum Leap later changed some of its own rules, Sam's "transformations" were really illusions. In "What Price Gloria." where Sam played a sexually harassed secretary he uses his male strength against the antagonist.

I guess I could answer this myself by looking, but in general superheroes don't interest me and I don't care to peruse the site to figure out the patterns for inclusion. So would Superman not be included, but Spiderman or The Thing merit inclusion? Or are all Superheroes listed under mythical?

The crossdressing in Shezow is boldly stated over and over. I wonder if this is less offensive than having him truly become a girl? I have run across some judgemental "news" sites that call Shezow a transexual superhero.

It seems like this entry could influence or change what is an acceptable "transformation" to be included here. It is undoubtedly a grey area.

Good discussion, though.

From: cj , 133 months, post #13
In my opinion...

Superman would not be included... he is always Superman, just sometimes disguised as "mild-mannered" Clark Kent.

Spiderman could be included, but except for notable TFs only for the initial radioactive spider bite that TF'd him from normal to having super-human abilities.

The Thing, certainly a TF as he went from human Ben to The Thing.

I hadn't thought about superheroes being mythical, but I guess they are... modern mythological figures.

To me the crossdressing vs actual gender TF carries no stigma or offense... to me it's simply just is a costume or disguise vs an actual TF.

Outside of this site, others like it, and the transgender and cross-dressing communities - I wouldn't expect others to really understand off-hand the difference. Most see all of it as the same thing due to lack of interest, education, and/or understanding.

From: Holly Dunn , 133 months, post #14
So if you list Shezow under Mythical for example, isn't that going to open a can of worms? Will you then have to go back and start putting nearly every comic book hero and villain in the database?

From: paul , 133 months, post #15
To make the list there needs to be a transformation or the appearance of a transformation. Body swaps aren't transformations but they have the appearance of being a transformation. There isn't much of a difference between two people being body swapped and two people being transformed to look like each other. Possessions from the point of view of the possessor appear to be transformations. Quantum Leap claimed it was just a location change. But there were inconsistence in that explanation that made it unclear to the audience if that was case. A person using a holographic disguise can appear to be transforming into someone else.

In Shezow, does the main character think he has turned into girl? Do other characters in the show watching him think he has changed into a girl? Does the viewing audience think mistakenly that he has transformed? These would all be grounds for inclusion. So far I have heard that all of these are not the case, so marking it for deletion is the correct action. I do not accept the argument that a change of clothes feels transformative is worthy of inclusion. Unless the character actually believes they have been physically changed.

From: guest (Miss Pinky) , 133 months, post #16
I thought that everyone except the boy's best friend think that he really IS 'SheZow, female superhero' when he turns into his super identity.

From: sexualitylab , 133 months, post #17

>Do other characters in the show watching him think he has changed into a girl?

Yes, and not just a girl, but a superheroine named SheZow.

>Does the viewing audience think mistakenly that he has transformed?

Yes, without the clarity from its creator, it appears that he has become SheZow in both form and dress.

For all intents and purposes, whether you believe it's a true "gender" transformation or not, the main character transforms into a superhero, and it is not merely a disguise. In my view, the show meets the guidelines for entry and deserves to stay.

From: cj , 133 months, post #18

Is physical transformation a requirement?

I was under the impression that a transformation from normal human to super human (super-human powers of strength or other ability), would also qualify as an actual transformation.


From: Holly Dunn , 133 months, post #19
I'm repeating myself, but I think if you make super powers qualify as a transformation you will need to catalog infinite lists of heroes and villains from every comic book universe.

Leaving it as a gender post with an explanation such it "appears to be a transformation though the creators say it is crossdressing," would be reasonable. You might even state that its inclusion is a "grey area." That lets people know what to expect.

People in the cartoon do think Shezow is a different person, and it seems to me like it is similar to "illusion" listings.

It isn't a very interesting cartoon, but the discussion is intriguing.

From: cj , 133 months, post #20
"if you make super powers qualify as a transformation you will need to catalog infinite lists of heroes and villains from every comic book universe."

Superman and Thor are not TF'd to have super-powers, their being from another world gives them super-human abilities on our planet. So they wouldn't qualify.

Batman has no super-human powers, just brains and tools. The Shadow acquired his "powers" through being taught. Neither of these are really TFs either.

IF "Super-powers" became a category here, I would expect quite a few entries to show up, but not every super-hero would qualify. However, since this is a TF board and not a superhero board - I would expect this as a secondary (if even that high) catalog, as there are already many more sites dedicated to superheros than to TFs.

I do dread the work-load though, I've been so busy with life outside of Metamorphose that I haven't been able to keep up with my own goal of helping clear the submission backlog.

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